Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby ozzzie » Thu Mar 08, 2012 2:15 pm

Horse wrote:
Does that help? Is it clearer, now, why I've been posting the more recent links and questions?



So you're saying that we need to include chapter 1 of Roadcraft in order to be successful? Teaching core skills alone will lead to over-confidence, but if it is blended with attitudinal changes, it will be successful?

Or am I over-simplifying things there?
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby Horse » Thu Mar 08, 2012 7:25 pm

Edit to clarify:

No, Perhaps & Yes
Last edited by Horse on Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby jogler » Thu Mar 08, 2012 9:30 pm

When a thread has reached 6 pages, has it outlived it's usefulness? Discuss. Answers on a postage stamp. :P
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby ozzzie » Thu Mar 08, 2012 9:35 pm

jogler wrote:When a thread has reached 6 pages, has it outlived it's usefulness? Discuss. Answers on a postage stamp. :P


It takes Horse that long to depress all our observers enough that they give up. :)
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby Horse » Thu Mar 08, 2012 11:41 pm

ozzzie wrote:
jogler wrote:When a thread has reached 6 pages, has it outlived it's usefulness? Discuss. Answers on a postage stamp. :P


It takes Horse that long to depress all our observers enough that they give up. :)


Cheer up, ya miserable sod :)

If you (or anyone else) want to give up it'll be nothing to do with whatever I say. For that matter, whether or not you want to change what - and how - you do is not my choice, it's up to each and every one of you.

If you (plural) want, then pick my brains.

Otherwise, if some observers can't cope with long threads, and if it's what you want, then I'll let the thread stagnate ;)
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby tfdodo » Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:45 pm

jogler wrote:When a thread has reached 6 pages, has it outlived it's usefulness? Discuss. Answers on a postage stamp. :P


Perish the thought that we have relevant threads that interest people and encourage participation :eek:
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby Horse » Sat Dec 29, 2012 1:49 pm

tfdodo wrote:
jogler wrote:When a thread has reached 6 pages, has it outlived it's usefulness? Discuss. Answers on a postage stamp. :P


Perish the thought that we have relevant threads that interest people and encourage participation :eek:


So, 9 months gestation on . . . did anything come from this thread?

Did Billy get given sole ownership of the task?

Do BAM Observers now have a substantially better idea of how to use success criteria?

Go on, surprise me ;-) :)


Happy New Year :mrgreen:
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby Horse » Sun Jan 06, 2013 12:10 am

So is that 'no, we didn't bother', or 'we could find no reason to change' or just 'no-one comes here any more'?
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby ozzzie » Sun Jan 06, 2013 11:00 am

Horse wrote:So is that 'no, we didn't bother', or 'we could find no reason to change' or just 'no-one comes here any more'?


It might be "Oh, it's Horse again." :)
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby Horse » Sun Jan 06, 2013 12:32 pm

ozzzie wrote:
Horse wrote:So is that 'no, we didn't bother', or 'we could find no reason to change' or just 'no-one comes here any more'?


It might be "Oh, it's Horse again." :)


:)

Spotted your typo ;) :

"Oh, it's Horse asking bleedy awkward questions just when we thought he'd cleared off"

:)
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby wunwinglow » Sun Jan 06, 2013 1:43 pm

Horse, the central message seemed to be training of any sort has no impact on KIA rates.

I just left the conversation feeling completely deflated.

Happy New Year.

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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby Horse » Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:50 pm

wunwinglow wrote:Horse, the central message seemed to be training of any sort has no impact on KIA rates.

I just left the conversation feeling completely deflated.

Happy New Year.

Tim



In that case, you flounced prematurely ;)
The thread went on to cover lesson planning using success criteria and learning intentions.

Have a re-read. Also, bear in mind that, IIRC, I said I believe that good training works. Actually, the truth is that 'bad' training will work too - but not in the way intended, and that's where LI and SC come in.
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby ozzzie » Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:25 pm

Billy continues to move forward the training standards of the group in a much more organised and planned way than is happening nationally with the IAM (IMHO). Continuous improvement is at the heart of what we do and we're a world away from certain groups that do things a specific way because that's how it's always been done.

There is only so much time available though and we focus on those elements that are highest on the list of priorities and/or quick wins. People within the group are very committed to working on that, but not always left with the energy and patience to engage in public debates about that process and related topics. Often, individuals' views are noted and filed for future reference, but that's all at that point.
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby Horse » Sun Jan 06, 2013 10:27 pm

ozzzie wrote:Billy continues to move forward the training standards of the group in a much more organised and planned way than is happening nationally with the IAM (IMHO). Continuous improvement is at the heart of what we do and we're a world away from certain groups that do things a specific way because that's how it's always been done.

There is only so much time available though and we focus on those elements that are highest on the list of priorities and/or quick wins. People within the group are very committed to working on that, but not always left with the energy and patience to engage in public debates about that process and related topics. Often, individuals' views are noted and filed for future reference, but that's all at that point.


Ah. That'll be a 'no' then? :)

If that's the case, then you've missed a very easy but effective 'quick win'. Should you decide to go further, please ask.

However, don't take my word for it, here are a few examples:


http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&safe=act ... 04&bih=679

You'll note, if you read through them, that one (the PPT) mentions:

‘If learners are to take more responsibility for their own learning, then they need to know what they are going to learn, how they will recognise when they have succeeded and why they should learn it in the first place.’
- (An Intro to AfL, Learning Unlimited, 2004)


This echoes the 'coaching' philosophy which DSA are currently evaluating.
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Re: Dubious IAM statement on bike safety

Postby ozzzie » Sun Jan 06, 2013 11:34 pm

It think we're experiencing an example of the gap between academia and its ideals, and practical organisational management.
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